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Post by hey on Sept 26, 2023 9:35:19 GMT -6
Gibson also used nylon for the bridge saddles. I know this because I own an LP custom with them on it. Mine is from the 70s. Love that guitar!
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Post by GuitarAttack Forum on Sept 26, 2023 14:19:33 GMT -6
Guitar cables? Hum... Here is one I know a lot of people go on about. Now, I bet I have spent thousands of dollars in cables over the years. The cheap ones last a short time when on the road. So I wound up buying more expensive ones. I bought one cable that was like $200.00 for 10 feet. I had more problems out that cable than some of my $25.00 cables. It seemed to me, no mater what I spent on a cable, the 1/4" jack would always come loose at the solder points.
The one able I had that I liked a lot and lasted a number of years was a directional cable. You could only sue it in one direction. It was not cheap. But what I liked about it was, it was not a noisy cable. I never got outside noise coming through my amp.
But again, some will argue that they can hear a tone difference in cables. Really? I never could. Bet my dog couldn't as well. The last cable I bought a few years ago. I spent $60.00 on it. So far it has been a good cable. Nothing real special about it. Just a will made cable and made with good wire.
I never believed the low-capacitance cable hype either. That is until I got my first George L's cable for my recording rig. I had been using some kind of low-end cables and I thought they were OK, then I tortured myself and did an A-B with the same guitar and same levels. As much as I hated to admit it, it did sound different - better - or at least I think it did! I wound up with a really rare Bill Lawrence cable when I worked at GC. I still use it between my Kemper and audio interface. It sounds great and I want to believe! Just think about the old, coiled patch cords Hendrix, Beck, Page, et al used making those recordings we love. One thing I do is use Deoxit to clean the plugs on the cable when I record. It is wild to see how dirty they get and it is very satisfying to clean them up! John
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Post by antares on Sept 26, 2023 16:35:17 GMT -6
I stick with blue chip manufacturers' connectors. It's a thing that I've taken from sleuthing problems with lowball Pacific Rim radio frequency connectors, and I've just gone on to adopt it for audio / guitars too. I go for Neutrik™ T.S. connectors, and in particular their Silent™ range. These have a nifty spring loaded momentary action switch in the guise of a tubular metal sleeve outside the connector's signal carrying shaft, and the connector remains open circuit until fully inserted, at which point the depressed spring loaded tubular sleeve flips the switch inside the plug's body. This means that you can insert and remove plugs with the amp turned up to eleven. Although they are pricey, once you get used to them you don't want to go back. I still have a few Whirlwind™ solid brass carcass connectors and they are bomb proof (if not silent.)
I don't really subscribe to the low capacitance cable thing as such because the picoFarads capacitance per unit length is in parallel with the triple figure microFarads capacitors that we put across tone potentiometers, and so the cable capacitance is swamped to such an extent that it shouldn't be noticeable. Theoretically! If it was in series it would be a whole other enchilada. A good / substantial braided outer screen is kind of mandatory though. Due to the differential mode of signals between the centre conductor and the braided shield, the centre conductor doesn't actually "know" that it is going round and round the coils, and it wouldn't matter much if it did at audio frequencies because the imagined increased inductance is multi orders of magnitude too low to be of any consequence. Think of the enormous value of inductance needed in a Varitone circuit to work at audio frequencies, and then look at those curly cable coils again.
I note that the disciple of all things 1960s, Dan Auerbach gives the impression that he wouldn't be seen dead without a curly coil cable, but that seems to me to be a little like chasing the Eric Johnson effects pedal battery voltage dragon? Dan gets a beyond really cool sound for the material he writes and plays though, so what do I know?
I think quality cables are robust and so have an inherent longevity which translates to good reliability. They are usually lower in noise pickup too due to the quality screening. For those reasons (and within sensible price limits) it's a fool's policy to choose cheap junker cables.
でつ e&oe ...
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Post by dnic on Sept 26, 2023 21:16:52 GMT -6
I stick with blue chip manufacturers' connectors. It's a thing that I've taken from sleuthing problems with lowball Pacific Rim radio frequency connectors, and I've just gone on to adopt it for audio / guitars too. I go for Neutrik™ T.S. connectors, and in particular their Silent™ range. These have a nifty spring loaded momentary action switch in the guise of a tubular metal sleeve outside the connector's signal carrying shaft, and the connector remains open circuit until fully inserted, at which point the depressed spring loaded tubular sleeve flips the switch inside the plug's body. This means that you can insert and remove plugs with the amp turned up to eleven. Although they are pricey, once you get used to them you don't want to go back. I still have a few Whirlwind™ solid brass carcass connectors and they are bomb proof (if not silent.) I don't really subscribe to the low capacitance cable thing as such because the picoFarads capacitance per unit length is in parallel with the triple figure microFarads capacitors that we put across tone potentiometers, and so the cable capacitance is swamped to such an extent that it shouldn't be noticeable. Theoretically! If it was in series it would be a whole other enchilada. A good / substantial braided outer screen is kind of mandatory though. Due to the differential mode of signals between the centre conductor and the braided shield, the centre conductor doesn't actually "know" that it is going round and round the coils, and it wouldn't matter much if it did at audio frequencies because the imagined increased inductance is multi orders of magnitude too low to be of any consequence. Think of the enormous value of inductance needed in a Varitone circuit to work at audio frequencies, and then look at those curly cable coils again. I note that the disciple of all things 1960s, Dan Auerbach gives the impression that he wouldn't be seen dead without a curly coil cable, but that seems to me to be a little like chasing the Eric Johnson effects pedal battery voltage dragon? Dan gets a beyond really cool sound for the material he writes and plays though, so what do I know? I think quality cables are robust and so have an inherent longevity which translates to good reliability. They are usually lower in noise pickup too due to the quality screening. For those reasons (and within sensible price limits) it's a fool's policy to choose cheap junker cables. でつ e&oe ...Yeah, ah, what Steve said. Rubber stamp thumbs up!
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Post by dnic on Sept 26, 2023 21:19:58 GMT -6
Guitar cables? Hum... Here is one I know a lot of people go on about. Now, I bet I have spent thousands of dollars in cables over the years. The cheap ones last a short time when on the road. So I wound up buying more expensive ones. I bought one cable that was like $200.00 for 10 feet. I had more problems out that cable than some of my $25.00 cables. It seemed to me, no mater what I spent on a cable, the 1/4" jack would always come loose at the solder points.
The one able I had that I liked a lot and lasted a number of years was a directional cable. You could only sue it in one direction. It was not cheap. But what I liked about it was, it was not a noisy cable. I never got outside noise coming through my amp.
But again, some will argue that they can hear a tone difference in cables. Really? I never could. Bet my dog couldn't as well. The last cable I bought a few years ago. I spent $60.00 on it. So far it has been a good cable. Nothing real special about it. Just a will made cable and made with good wire.
I never believed the low-capacitance cable hype either. That is until I got my first George L's cable for my recording rig. I had been using some kind of low-end cables and I thought they were OK, then I tortured myself and did an A-B with the same guitar and same levels. As much as I hated to admit it, it did sound different - better - or at least I think it did! I wound up with a really rare Bill Lawrence cable when I worked at GC. I still use it between my Kemper and audio interface. It sounds great and I want to believe! Just think about the old, coiled patch cords Hendrix, Beck, Page, et al used making those recordings we love. One thing I do is use Deoxit to clean the plugs on the cable when I record. It is wild to see how dirty they get and it is very satisfying to clean them up! John John I love the way you have been saying things like, "at least it does to me" or "at least I think it did". Leaves a little wiggle room. Oh and the pile of cables that Hendix, Page and Beck must have hauled all over the place not to mention all of us. LOt of great music coming through those old cables.
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Post by antares on Sept 27, 2023 1:12:13 GMT -6
Something else came to mind, in another thread we discussed wireless links and I noted that I have an inexpensive AKG example. When I first purchased it, there was a truly unacceptable level of microphonic noise created every time the cable draped along your leg or you brushed along it with your hand or arm. I bought a replacement aftermarket one from Amazon which didn't work at all, and it turned out to have been wired incorrectly. Sure I could have fixed it, but I was kind of insulted with the total absence of quality assurance so I returned it. I purchased a Neutrik mini XLR, a Neutrik 1/4" "Silent" connector and some quality Klotz™ cable and made my own. Job done. A plague on AKG for saving pennies on cable.
A great thread Dane!
でつ e&oe ...
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Post by antares on Sept 27, 2023 1:26:06 GMT -6
"Brass Everything"
Now that was a hype, but not in an obvious way because there was nothing wrong with brass in my opinion, only the wildfire scramble to adopt its use. In addition the massive kickback against brass was just as unfounded. I went down the brass rabbit hole with my first Columbus "Strat". It didn't "improve" anything, but neither was it detrimental. I still believe that a solid anchor point of which brass nuts and saddles are a good example cannot be all that as bad as the commentators made out. I referred to the great sounds produced on ES335s with plastic saddles, and I reckon it's a brave man that would hold forth that any improvements might have been possible, but it still makes sense to me to provide a solid anchor point. That video with the string stretched across a void between to solid points provides a strong argument for that, but I have a strong suspicion that it would have been no different had he used nylon at each end.
Edit; it's painfully obvious that focussing on sustain, I've casually avoided the subjective "tone" side of the brass debate!
でつ e&oe ...
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Post by Hey! on Sept 27, 2023 7:02:14 GMT -6
I think that John hit the nail on the head when he said something about cleaning the cable jack and the input/output jack on the guitar. I have found that to be true as well. I had a guitar that was giving me fits in not having a good connection. Likewise, I cleaned the jack on the guitar and the problem went away.
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Post by dnic on Sept 27, 2023 8:40:15 GMT -6
Something else came to mind, in another thread we discussed wireless links and I noted that I have an inexpensive AKG example. When I first purchased it, there was a truly unacceptable level of microphonic noise created every time the cable draped along your leg or you brushed along it with your hand or arm. I bought a replacement aftermarket one from Amazon which didn't work at all, and it turned out to have been wired incorrectly. Sure I could have fixed it, but I was kind of insulted with the total absence of quality assurance so I returned it. I purchased a Neutrik mini XLR, a Neutrik 1/4" "Silent" connector and some quality Klotz™ cable and made my own. Job done. A plague on AKG for saving pennies on cable. A great thread Dane! でつ e&oe ...Shielding is King, Steve.
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Post by dnic on Sept 27, 2023 8:50:31 GMT -6
"Brass Everything" Now that was a hype, but not in an obvious way because there was nothing wrong with brass in my opinion, only the wildfire scramble to adopt its use. In addition the massive kickback against brass was just as unfounded. I went down the brass rabbit hole with my first Columbus "Strat". It didn't "improve" anything, but neither was it detrimental. I still believe that a solid anchor point of which brass nuts and saddles are a good example cannot be all that as bad as the commentators made out. I referred to the great sounds produced on ES335s with plastic saddles, and I reckon it's a brave man that would hold forth that any improvements might have been possible, but it still makes sense to me to provide a solid anchor point. That video with the string stretched across a void between to solid points provides a strong argument for that, but I have a strong suspicion that it would have been no different had he used nylon at each end. Edit; it's painfully obvious that focussing on sustain, I've casually avoided the subjective "tone" side of the brass debate! でつ e&oe ...This "famous" client of mine with all the steels and laps and Martins and strats and teles. He had a tele with a three saddle bridge all saddle were brass. He had me change out the low E and A string saddle with a steel one. A tone thing. I can't say I heard a difference. Don't know about the sustain either. That might have been during his Beck phase.
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Post by dnic on Sept 27, 2023 8:54:18 GMT -6
I think that John hit the nail on the head when he said something about cleaning the cable jack and the input/output jack on the guitar. I have found that to be true as well. I had a guitar that was giving me fits in not having a good connection. Likewise, I cleaned the jack on the guitar and the problem went away. On a related note, there was a 1/4" fiber rod on the market (some years ago) used specifically for inserting into a jack socket for cleaning. I never got any but it seamed like a great idea. Was it StewMac?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2023 16:10:32 GMT -6
This looks like a lot of fun!
Here is one for ya! If you buy an SRV Start, you will sound like SRV! LOL! I heard a GC sales person use that on someone buying a guitar. WOW!
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Post by dnic on Sept 27, 2023 19:04:25 GMT -6
This looks like a lot of fun! Here is one for ya! If you buy an SRV Start, you will sound like SRV! LOL! I heard a GC sales person use that on someone buying a guitar. WOW!
Hi stealth, I've heard some pretty crazy stuff from GC folks. I'll post them later on.
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Post by antares on Sept 28, 2023 2:15:10 GMT -6
"Shielding is King, Steve"
Too right Dane, but the shielding needs to be properly grounded, just shielding something alone is insufficient, and you also have to be aware of unintentionally creating hum inducing "ground loops".
でつ e&oe ...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2023 6:26:03 GMT -6
"Shielding is King, Steve" Too right Dane, but the shielding needs to be properly grounded, just shielding something alone is insufficient, and you also have to be aware of unintentionally creating hum inducing "ground loops". でつ e&oe ...I stopped using "shielding" A long time ago. I don't have issues out of my guitars.
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