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Post by dnic on May 3, 2021 7:01:57 GMT -6
Art and budget are uneasy bedfellows Eddie. e&oe ...absostinkinlutly!
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Post by Deleted on May 3, 2021 9:42:29 GMT -6
Art and budget are uneasy bedfellows Eddie. e&oe ...Yep... I can't think of one build that has come under budget. So many of them turn into major projects. But, it seems like almost everything I do turns into a big project. Even the things that should be simple. LOL! I do get the job done sooner or later.
I cannot understand how for some that they can do things, like pore epoxy resin and have no issues. I do what they do and it ends up in a big mess. On the back of this build I even tried another way of poring. It looked like it was going to work out. But no, right as it was starting to cure all these bubbles showed up. They showed up at a point that nothing could be done about it.
So, I have no choice but to start sanding this guitar. It looks like I might be able to sand a lot of the bubbles out. But this stuff is not an easy thing to sand. It will take me some time. Once I get it to where it looks like something again, I will be spraying on Lacquer or poly over it. Then once that is on, it will sit for a few weeks for cure time.
EB
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Post by Deleted on May 4, 2021 12:19:30 GMT -6
This build is driving me nuts!!! I started sanding on it today, and wouldn't you know it there is one whole corner that had not cured! It was going so well too. So, I guess I'll wait a few more days to see how it looks. But the one spot blistered up and it's not a small spot. I will wait and see how it looks in a day or two, then fill in with some thick CA glue. I hope it plays fair.
Again! I will never use epoxy Resin again! Last time ever. It wont be the last time for fabric.
I guess I can go and buy a heat gun and see if I can peal off the resin and the cloth. I have enough cloth to try again. But if I do, I will do it the way I stared out. oh, the spot that's not cured all the way is on the front! What a big mess. I do not recommend anyone doing this with fabric. I don't care how many people show ya other wise! Not worth the headache or the money.
So at this point I don't when the build will get done.
EB
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Post by dnic on May 5, 2021 7:18:18 GMT -6
Oh man, I feel ya brother.
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Post by antares on May 5, 2021 9:23:53 GMT -6
I don't know what to say Eddie other than it's guys like you that push the envelope, and the occasional massive hiccup is implicit in treading that bold path. You'll strip it back and go with a method that'll give you what you want, I know you'll get onto it when your mind's in a better place.
e&oe ...
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Post by Deleted on May 5, 2021 10:07:17 GMT -6
Going to try and fix the spot that is bad first. I have some ideas on it. So, I'll be trying out the ideas soon. The thing that frustrating with the epoxy is I mixed it like it says to. Takes up to 6min of mixing time and using 3 different mixing cups to mix this stuff. There should have been no soft spots in it anywhere.
The epoxy was hard on top, but not under it. As soon as I sanded thorough the (cured) part, it was like jelly under it. I don't know what went wrong. It shows me once again that something things are not what they are cracked up to be! Well, I'll see if I can save what I have on there. I sure don't want to have to take all back down to wood and start all over again.
EB
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Post by antares on May 6, 2021 3:12:05 GMT -6
That's a conundrum Eddie because Epoxy sets chemically, not by exposure to air, and is accelerated by heat. Least aways that's what I've always understood. There's a lesson to be learned from your set back, but I suspect we'll not get to the bottom of it. Suffice to say that I had exactly the same experience with my walking stick handle, although it was far easier to rework.
e&oe ...
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2021 8:59:51 GMT -6
That's a conundrum Eddie because Epoxy sets chemically, not by exposure to air, and is accelerated by heat. Least aways that's what I've always understood. There's a lesson to be learned from your set back, but I suspect we'll not get to the bottom of it. Suffice to say that I had exactly the same experience with my walking stick handle, although it was far easier to rework. e&oe ...yes, that is what I was thinking too. The cups that I mixed this stuff in got hot in the last cup. So hot I could not hold it. Of course it cured like a rock in the cup.
Going to do some testing on it today. I have some 15min epoxy I may try and use to see if I can get the spot to harden up. I think I can hide most of it if does work and it comes out a little off in color, because, it's close to the round over edge. I can maybe do a fade with some black paint. But, that's if it will harden up.
EB
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2021 12:55:13 GMT -6
Right at this moment it looks like my patch job is going to work. It says to it cure for 4 to 6hrs. Before doing anything else with it. Like sanding. LOL
I didn't get any pictures of it before I started on it. but this upper horn was where the problem was.
Don't know if you can see the patch or not. But it goes from the neck to the top of the guitar. and over the round over.
I hope that this patch will work. What I did I use a little lacquer thinner to get most of the goo of it. I then use a two part epoxy that comes in tubes and you squirt it out at the same time then mix it up. Sets up in 15 but take a few hours to cure all the way. Once this is where I can work on it again, I'll finish sanding it and I bought some new clear I think I am going to try on it. I sprayed it on a test piece and some on the guitar and it looks good. It is supposed to be fully dry in less than an hour. But you know how that goes.
Yep it is a nice day to be working on my builds. EB
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2021 9:40:27 GMT -6
So far so good. I looked at this morning and my patch looks good. No soft spots as far as I can tell. It will have to wait before I can do any sanding on it right now. I am trying to get the Teak Wood guitar finish done.
If the weather will hold out for an other day, I should be able to start sanding on this one tomorrow. I hope I can it to were I can spray on the clear I have for it. I am still going to make a spray booth to do this in. More like a spray box. I have this clothing box that I saved from the move. I think it will make a good box to spray this build in.
In my test this spray looks like glass or wet like water. It will be interesting to see if it fully drys like the can says. More to come on that!
EB
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2021 14:52:15 GMT -6
Aright! I got somewhere with today.
To start of at, I bought some of this stuff to try it out. It is water based. I thought I would try it on the peg head as a sealer.
The water based clear soaked into the cloth and has sealed it off pretty good. Sometime in the next day or two I'll apply some epoxy resin to it. I want to see if I still will get a lot of air bubbles. Someone on another FB forum told me the reason I got so many air bubbles was because I didn't seal off the cloth first.
Here is the guitar after a lot of sanding.
These are 2 of the tools I used for sanding. I also used my drill press with drum sanders on it to get the sides of the guitar nice again.
I used 100 grit sand paper to start the sanding.
Trying to figure out how to blend the neck and body. I think I'll end up painting the neck black like the sides will be.
My patch worked out great! No more soft spots!
Tomorrow I'll sand with 320 then I may go to 400. That should get most of the scratch out that I got with the 100 grit. I can't believe that I do have 2 spots where I sanded through to the cloth. But I think I'll be OK once I get the spray clear on. I'll have to watch what I am doing when I sand with the 320.
I am super pleased that things went better today on this build. Sanding this today reminded me of doing fiber glass work and gel coat. It goes everywhere. I was hoping to get the black paint on it tomorrow but once again it is supposed to rain. Grrr.
Well, that's all for today. I may do some lite sanding on Ms. Candy tomorrow if it's raining.
EB
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Post by antares on May 10, 2021 2:07:27 GMT -6
Starting to turn around in your favour now Eddie. Cool. Thanks for this because your heads-up about not having sealed the fabric first has made me realise why I got bubbles- my walking stick handle is deer antler which is really porous. That's why the trial run in a plastic cup was fine. Mystery solved for me, cheers Brother.
e&oe ...
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Post by dnic on May 10, 2021 7:10:17 GMT -6
Glad something went mostly right for you Eddie. Sand thrus are always the thing we try to avoid but also why finishing is so tricky. Guess you could paint those areas black because so much of the background is black. 100 to 320 is a pretty big jump in grit. maybe 220 next.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2021 7:56:27 GMT -6
Glad something went mostly right for you Eddie. Sand thrus are always the thing we try to avoid but also why finishing is so tricky. Guess you could paint those areas black because so much of the background is black. 100 to 320 is a pretty big jump in grit. maybe 220 next. I would go to 220 but I don't have any. It's stormy today, so, I can't go to the hardware store today. (I don't drive anymore)
Plus the store around here are weird when it come to sand paper. They stock stuff in odd ways. I can find like 80 grit all over the place. But try and find 220, 320,400. I was lucky the other day I found some 1000, 1500 and 2000 grit. I have not seen them in the stores at all. But all they had was 320 and 80 so, I got that while I was there. I try and buy sand paper as I can. I go through a lot of it. It too has really gone up in price.
I sanded through the epoxy only. I didn't go through all the way to the wood. Not yet anyways... LOL!
But there is one spot where I'll have to use a little black paint on it. I didn't quite get enough fabric on it in one small spot. But it's on the round over and I think once I get the sides painted black I'll be able to cover it up.
If anyone is thinking of doing a cloth top on a guitar. Put the fabric on the wood first before you cut the body out or at least before any round overs and routing for pickups and drilling holes. It will save you a bunch of problems.
EB
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2021 8:04:07 GMT -6
Starting to turn around in our favour now Eddie. Cool. Thanks for this because your heads-up about not having sealed the fabric first has made me realise why I got bubbles- my walking stick handle is deer antler which is really porous. That's why the trial run in a plastic cup was fine. Mystery solved for me, cheers Brother. e&oe ...Yes, I wish I would have fallowed my instinct and sealed it off from the start. This is one of them times I wished I would not have looked a videos. I knew better too. I use to work with resin a lot back in the 70's. I use to make wooded plant holders that I use epoxy resin on to seal off the wood from water. I use to seal off the woods before putting on the resin. So, I should have done what I knew to do.
I felt so stupid when when the guy the other day told me why I had so many bubbles. LOL! Well, I'll know better next time. If there is a next time. I don't like epoxy. But, like everything we are always learning or relearning how to do things.
EB
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