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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2009 9:32:32 GMT -6
I use to have a few spry guns when I was building cars. I had this one touch up gun I loved I used it like an air brush most of the time. I was looking at the Cobalt gun at Lowes just the other day. I'll have to see if I can get someone to donate to my cause! HE! HE!
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Post by dnic on Mar 18, 2009 11:51:00 GMT -6
My buddy Visa helps me out every so often.
d
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2009 16:44:13 GMT -6
That's a good one dinic!!
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Post by dnic on Apr 15, 2009 23:29:21 GMT -6
I've been busy with work and also work in the shop with a cabinet job. So the guitar hung for about 3 weeks. Then I was in Colorado Springs for a week at my Moms tiling her bathroom floor. Before I left home I noticed some small cracks in the finish at some holes and the edge of the pup rout. When I got back (I left the guitar in the house while I was gone) the cracks had multiplied and grown a lot. Any ideas I had about CA gluing and drop filling went away this thing has to be stripped.   Maybe this will teach me not to sign them until they're finished   The only thing that is any different from my normal process is that I used a shellac under coat and I normally use lacquer vinyl sealer. But I had some shellac so I thought I'd save some lacquer. Yeah right. This is after about 1 1/2 hours of chipping the finish with a Dunlap .60 guitar pick.  Man what a pain. I have considered just making another body. I believe in honest reporting, warts and all. dane  |
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Post by cknowles on Apr 16, 2009 8:14:32 GMT -6
Woah!! Talk about major shrinkage. That really sucks.
I can only guess that the two finishes were somewhat incompatible (understatement? stating the blatantly obvious?)
Actually now that I'm thinking about it, what did you use as a thinner for the shellac? Is it possible that it had not completed out-gassing before you placed the top coat?
Chris
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2009 8:30:55 GMT -6
It does sound like the shellac is what did it.
I had that happen on a car once but I put too much hardener in the paint.(that was a mess) I haven't seen anyone use a hardener in there paint on guitars on here.
I would guess like cknowles that the shellac didn't out-gas (or dry all the way) I used a shellac primer on one build I learned I had to let it dry for a day or two before I could paint it. ( I hate re dos)
If you cut another body I'll take that one off your hands! HE! HE!
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Post by dnic on Apr 16, 2009 9:17:26 GMT -6
I used the shellac because I have read guys like Dan E. And Frank Ford say it's the best possible under coater and works well as a bearier coat between incompatible finish's. Chris, I'm not sure if I did thin the shellac. If I did I would have used denatured alcohol. That is what I cleaned the gun with. As far as dry time Eddie, It's been about six weeks or more and can't remember for sure but I think it was a day or two. This guitar has had more hang time then any one previous. One thing I know for sure is the shellac was canned not fresh made from flakes. I did scuff sand before the lacquer but may have used to fine of paper there are no sanding scratches for the lacquer to grab. That is one of the big reasons I use lacquer over polys for guitars as well as cabinets because it's a reactive finish and bites into the previous coat. If I build another body Eddie, this one will be providing BTUs for me and my family.  dane |
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Post by shattered on Apr 16, 2009 10:21:18 GMT -6
Canned shellac doesn't last more than 2-3 years before it goes bad (knocking over old ladies, taking kids' lunch money, etc!).
I agree with Chris that you may have some curing issues. What kind of environment was it hanging in?
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Post by firsttimer on Apr 16, 2009 10:59:47 GMT -6
I love these body designs - wow!
start your own company dude!
ALSO - I was thinking about using shellac myself - but I think I might fore go that idea and go for a spray clear coat or a spray polyurethane or clear poly resin.
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Post by dnic on Apr 16, 2009 14:21:18 GMT -6
The hanging environment is my shop which is heated with a monitor brand kerosene heater. Never below 60 degrees when hanging, hotter when when actually spraying. The point is nothing changed in any of my normal procedure except the use of shellac. I did check the can and it was June 08 so technically not out of date. I'm just not going to use shellac again, only for french polish and that will be fresh from flakes. I really don't like backing up. firsttimer, I've always had great success with lacquer vinyl sealer as a base coat. With tint or whatever it has never been a problem. And, I am a company, if people would just start buying these things. The name is Jonah Custom Guitars. There is even a web site but the last time I tried to go on it wouldn't open so I need to check that out. I guess that since I'm trying to sell guitars I shouldn't publish my screw ups. Thanks for the input guys. It always helps to jump start my brain even if we don't hit on the exact problem. dane |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2009 14:59:03 GMT -6
I used the shellac because I have read guys like Dan E. And Frank Ford say it's the best possible under coater and works well as a bearier coat between incompatible finish's. Chris, I'm not sure if I did thin the shellac. If I did I would have used denatured alcohol. That is what I cleaned the gun with. As far as dry time Eddie, It's been about six weeks or more and can't remember for sure but I think it was a day or two. This guitar has had more hang time then any one previous. One thing I know for sure is the shellac was canned not fresh made from flakes. I did scuff sand before the lacquer but may have used to fine of paper there are no sanding scratches for the lacquer to grab. That is one of the big reasons I use lacquer over polys for guitars as well as cabinets because it's a reactive finish and bites into the previous coat. If I build another body Eddie, this one will be providing BTUs for me and my family. dane Oh No don't do that!!! (BTU) It can be fixed I know it can. But I do know how you feel. I have had a few guitars that almost became firewood.  |
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Post by irishrover on Apr 16, 2009 20:20:38 GMT -6
ive had more than a few body's go into the stove in my shop lol
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Post by killemall1983 on Apr 16, 2009 21:34:32 GMT -6
Did you wet sand the body? I have seen that 100000000000000 times when water gets into the holes, and makes it crack. More commonly with basswood and poplar.
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Post by dnic on Apr 16, 2009 23:42:19 GMT -6
I know what you mean about wet sanding. I use naphtha and it doesn't raise the grain as much as water. In my early experience with wet sanding, my very first guitar, I had a problem with water in the holes and the wood swelled around the holes and if I hadn't noticed I would have sanded to the wood right around the holes. Didn't have any cracks caused by it though. dane |
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Post by dnic on Apr 17, 2009 13:28:02 GMT -6
I just reread an article by Frank Ford at frets.com and now realize that I am indeed a complete moron even with some of the parts missing. www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Luthier/ProductReviews/Materials/Zinsser/zinsser.htmlAnyway I will also add a bit of the text in case you are not inclined to read the whole article. "All in all, you can't beat good old shellac, and now you can buy it conveniently packaged at the paint store. Or, at least you can have the paint store order it for you - none of my local paint shops actually stock this great product. They do, however, stock the old crummy regular Zinsser Bull's Eye Shellac that is useful for painting walls or whatever. STAY AWAY FROM THE REGULAR LIQUID SHELLAC." From Frank Ford at frets.com Guess which product I used for my under coat. dane |
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